Page 1 of 1 [ 8 posts ] 
Author
Message
Post subject: What other defensive weapons can we legally carry?
Post Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2016 4:42 pm
Specifically, can we carry an extendable baton?

Generally, what can we legally carry other than a firearm?
Top
Offline
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2016 9:06 pm
Posts: 1
Post subject: Re: What other defensive weapons can we legally carry?
Post Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2016 7:26 pm
You cannot carry any deadly weapon other than a handgun *concealed* in Ohio, even with a license. ORC 2923.11 defines "Deadly Weapon" as

Quote:
2923.11 Weapons control definitions.

As used in sections 2923.11 to 2923.24 of the Revised Code:

(A) "Deadly weapon" means any instrument, device, or thing capable of inflicting death, and designed or specially adapted for use as a weapon, or possessed, carried, or used as a weapon.


I could see an extendable baton going either way. My personal opinion is that it doesn't meet the standard but hey, I'm not a lawyer and am (probably) not going to be on the jury that has to decide your case if you get arrested over it.

Beyond that, open carry is of course legal.

Christian, Husband, Father
NRA Life Member
NRA Certified Range Safety Officer
NRA Certified Pistol & Rifle Instructor
Top
Offline
User avatar
Joined: Tue Jul 30, 2013 7:36 am
Posts: 680
Location: Akron/Canton
Post subject: Re: What other defensive weapons can we legally carry?
Post Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:48 pm
Exp:

Welcome aboard!

There's a sticky at http://forums.buckeyefirearms.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=10097 that you probably should have a look at. It's not mandatory, and may be sleep inducing....

JustaShooter's pretty well got the extendable baton thing. I was thinking about that last night (I've got a couple of them). I really was thinking that my daughter ought to carry one. She's got an M&P9C, but no license, so she can't carry it. (Why no CHL is a long story - I think she's been in the anti-freedom Kool-Aid from being a college student. She likes to shoot, but I think she likes to make noise :D.)

Short answer is that our CHL is for a "Concealed Handgun", not "Concealed Weapon".

Personally, I think your chances of getting hung out to dry for carrying an expandable baton are much slimmer than for carrying a firearm, but it's still a risk.

If you have a CHL to lose, it might not be a good idea at all.... My daughter would get away with it :D....

I'm a semi-retired (well, mostly retired) rent-a-cop, and picked up an expandable baton for uniform applications. No problems with plain sight when walking around, although it might get itchy in a car.

Overall, IMHO, a pretty stupid law, but then again we're in Ohio....

Regards,

Stu

(Why write a quick note when you can write a novel?)

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒE

יזכר לא עד פעם
Top
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 11:01 pm
Posts: 6704
Location: Youngstown OH
Post subject: Re: What other defensive weapons can we legally carry?
Post Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:58 pm
The Supreme Court has held that “the Second Amendment extends, prima facie, to all instruments that constitute bearable arms ***.” District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U. S. 570, 582 (2008), and that this “Second Amendment right is fully applicable to the States,” McDonald v. Chicago, 561 U. S. 742, 750 (2010).

Just five months ago the Supreme Court struck down Massachusetts' ban on stun guns in Caetano v. Massachusetts, 577 U.S. ___ (2016), (https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/1 ... 8_aplc.pdf) after reasoning:

"The lower court’s ill treatment of Heller cannot stand. The reasoning of the Massachusetts court poses a grave threat to the fundamental right of self-defense. The Supreme Judicial Court suggested that Caetano could have simply gotten a firearm to defend herself. 470 Mass., at 783, 26 N. E. 3d, at 695. But the right to bear other weapons is “no answer” to a ban on the possession of protected arms. Heller, 554 U. S., at 629. Moreover, a weapon is an effective means of self-defense only if one is prepared to use it, and it is presumptuous to tell Caetano she should have been ready to shoot the father of her two young children if she wanted to protect herself. Courts should not be in the business of demanding that citizens use more force for self-defense than they are comfortable wielding."

I can think of situations that I would rather use a baton, but Ohio law would force me to use a 45 instead.

"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms**disarm only those who [don't] commit crimes. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than prevent homicides." - Thomas Jefferson.
Top
Offline
User avatar
Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2011 10:45 am
Posts: 444
Location: Akron
Post subject: Re: What other defensive weapons can we legally carry?
Post Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2016 9:27 am
Liberty, we could perhaps get the Ohio House and Senate to make this fix legislatively I sure wouldn't want to be the defendant in such a case as things stand now.

"I have decided not to vote, speak in public, assemble in groups or petition my government either directly or by writing to the newspapers.

Some ignorant person may become alarmed, and we can't have that.''

--CAR15A2, 3/31/09
Top
Offline
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2009 9:07 pm
Posts: 1906
Location: SW Ohio
Post subject: Re: What other defensive weapons can we legally carry?
Post Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2016 2:12 am
Don't we need F.I.D license for carrying non-lethal weapon for self defense like pepper spray and baton?

Get firearms safety training online from an NRA certified school.
MA Gun License
Top
Offline
Joined: Mon Jul 13, 2015 6:58 am
Posts: 28
Location: Boston, MA
Post subject: Re: What other defensive weapons can we legally carry?
Post Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2016 6:35 am
GunnerJacky wrote:
Don't we need F.I.D license for carrying non-lethal weapon for self defense like pepper spray and baton?

Never heard of an F.I.D. license. Nothing is required to carry non- or less-lethal items for self defense in Ohio as far as I know (and I'd think I would have heard about it if there was).

Christian, Husband, Father
NRA Life Member
NRA Certified Range Safety Officer
NRA Certified Pistol & Rifle Instructor
Top
Offline
User avatar
Joined: Tue Jul 30, 2013 7:36 am
Posts: 680
Location: Akron/Canton
Post subject: Re: What other defensive weapons can we legally carry?
Post Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2016 9:08 am
Lets look at United States v. Cruikshank, 92 US 542, 553 - Supreme Court 1876
Quote:
The second and tenth counts are equally defective. The right there specified is that of "bearing arms for a lawful purpose." This is not a right granted by the Constitution. Neither is it in any manner dependent upon that instrument for its existence. The second amendment declares that it shall not be infringed; but this, as has been seen, means no more than that it shall not be infringed by Congress.


Now read Heller. Heller affirms Cruikshank by stating:
Quote:
United States v. Cruikshank, 92 U. S. 542, in the course of vacating the convictions of members of a white mob for depriving blacks of their right to keep and bear arms, held that the Second Amendment does not by its own force apply to anyone other than the Federal Government. The opinion explained that the right “is not a right granted by the Constitution [or] in any manner dependent upon that instrument for its existence. The second amendment . . . means no more than that it shall not be infringed by Congress.” 92 U. S., at 553.


Heller in its Syllabus also said:
Quote:
The “militia” comprised all males physically capable of acting in concert for the common defense. The Antifederalists feared that the Federal Government would disarm the people in order to disable this citizens’ militia, enabling a politicized standing army or a select militia to rule. The response was to deny Congress power to abridge the ancient right of individuals to keep and bear arms, so that the ideal of a citizens’ militia would be preserved.


With all this said by Heller, it only affirms that 18 USC 922(q) school gun free zone is unconstitutional. And no, the commerce clause can't be used as the backdoor.

The federal appeal courts intentionally overlook that very principle. But yet, what attorney has ever pointed that out.

And as Liberty pointed out: “Second Amendment right is fully applicable to the States,” McDonald v. Chicago, 561 U. S. 742, 750 (2010). And the Second Amendment says arms, not meaning just guns. A baton is an arm. The USSC has made clear that states may only expand your rights, they cannot limit those rights already recognized by the federal constitution.

But, the truth is that Ohio courts will never recognize your rights.
Top
Offline
Joined: Tue Jun 16, 2009 10:45 am
Posts: 2651
Location: Too close to Cincinnati
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 Page 1 of 1 [ 8 posts ] 

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum
Search for:
Jump to: