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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 1:26 pm
Liberty wrote:
I think we should understand something about the "law enforcement" objections to our freedoms. Those who voice objections to the legislature are not the rank and file. Those objecting are liberal lawyers (who are prosecutors and technically law enforcement) and the politically appointed (by anti-freedom politicians) chiefs and their high ranking officers whom they appoint.


You're correct, too many gun owners have no idea about this aspect of political wrangling.

"I have decided not to vote, speak in public, assemble in groups or petition my government either directly or by writing to the newspapers.

Some ignorant person may become alarmed, and we can't have that.''

--CAR15A2, 3/31/09
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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 3:10 pm
Union leadership is elected by the rank and file, aren't they?

"It is only when you do not have hope in a society that you join a suicide bomber team."
- George W. Bush
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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 3:57 pm
Chuck wrote:
Union leadership is elected by the rank and file, aren't they?


Oh yeah. That fact isn't lost on me. I've long imagined there's a behind the scenes dynamic at play that coerces a pro-gun cop who climbs the FOP ladder to change his/her mind, or be shunned if not ousted.

"I have decided not to vote, speak in public, assemble in groups or petition my government either directly or by writing to the newspapers.

Some ignorant person may become alarmed, and we can't have that.''

--CAR15A2, 3/31/09
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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 5:13 pm
Brian D. wrote:
Chuck wrote:
Union leadership is elected by the rank and file, aren't they?


Oh yeah. That fact isn't lost on me. I've long imagined there's a behind the scenes dynamic at play that coerces a pro-gun cop who climbs the FOP ladder to change his/her mind, or be shunned if not ousted.

Brian, most of us understand that the other half can't handle the truth. They would not even stand up and defend their rights. And a big chunk of that group is willing to compromise their rights away.
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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 9:27 pm
Here is what the NRA has to say.....

https://www.nraila.org/articles/2017091 ... substitute
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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 9:37 pm
color of law wrote:
Brian D. wrote:
Chuck wrote:
Union leadership is elected by the rank and file, aren't they?


Oh yeah. That fact isn't lost on me. I've long imagined there's a behind the scenes dynamic at play that coerces a pro-gun cop who climbs the FOP ladder to change his/her mind, or be shunned if not ousted.

Brian, most of us understand that the other half can't handle the truth. They would not even stand up and defend their rights. And a big chunk of that group is willing to compromise their rights away.


I never thought of it that way, but by golly, you're absolutely right!

"It is only when you do not have hope in a society that you join a suicide bomber team."
- George W. Bush
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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Sat Sep 16, 2017 6:50 pm
This is how my local TV news reports it, emphasis mine:

"House Bill 142 sponsored by Rep. Scott Wiggam was on its fifth hearing when Representative Glenn Holmes put forward a substitute piece of legislation and became a co-sponsor of the bill.

The original HB 142 allowed for concealed carry permit holders to withhold that information from a police officer if they are pulled over and eliminated the penalty for doing so.

The new bill is an about face on that stance
.

Now, the bill makes it mandatory that a person carrying a concealed weapon not only tell the officer they have the permit to do so and that they are armed, but to present the permit at the time they are asked for their license and registration.
"

So it's now the exact opposite of what it originally was? Remind me, why shouldn't the Statehouse be overrun with pitchforks and torches and reduced to a heap?

"Representative Holmes says the police officers will appreciate being notified of this, and it will help prevent tragedies like what occurred in Minnesota with Philando Castile."

Does Holmes talk to any real cops, or just the cop brass or the cop lobbyists?

"The new bill also adds an incentive to notifying the officer; failing to do so comes with a $25 fine if they are caught."

Yeah, an incentive gives you something good for doing something. A fine is a punishment. A fine is not an incentive.

My God. How are we not a friggin' Blue State, since we have a majority of Republican politicians who are cowards.
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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 7:48 am
I would love a link to that Local TV news report

"It is only when you do not have hope in a society that you join a suicide bomber team."
- George W. Bush
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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 10:03 pm
You're right Chuck. I should have posted a link.
I'll see if I can find it when I get a chance.
It was the 27wkbn website.
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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:23 am
les:

WKBN is part of a fair sized chain, and while a couple of the newsreader gals are seriously good looking, I have a feeling that some of their stuff is coming from "news central".

Regards,

Stu

(Why write a quick note when you can write a novel?)

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒE

יזכר לא עד פעם
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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:20 pm
Stu, instead of the pointless non-sequitors, how about you try to fetch Jim Irvine, Linda Walker, Chad Baus, or another BFA muckety muck over here to their own damn forums, to explain why Ohio licensees should support this turd wagon of a bill known as House Substitute 142? We should be stringing up the House Speaker and his squishy cronies by the ears, not going along with their kowtowing to the Ohio FOP, Buckeye Sheriffs Association, etc.

I'm not mad at YOU, Stu, just tired of how slow things move forward. Hopeful that your position as a moderator here will provide enough sway with Top Brass to get them here to explain themselves.

"I have decided not to vote, speak in public, assemble in groups or petition my government either directly or by writing to the newspapers.

Some ignorant person may become alarmed, and we can't have that.''

--CAR15A2, 3/31/09
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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:01 am
On BFA's home page, the article explaining the substitute HB142 is misleading . . . in a table comparing the current situation with sub HB142, the last line states:

Does presenting your CHL to the officer satisfy the requirement
to notify? (present situation) No (under sub HB142) Yes

Actually under sub HB142, one can present one's CHL, but one must also NOTIFY THAT ONE IS CARRYING A HANDGUN -- just handing over the CHL doesn't completely satify the notification requirement.

zeko
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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:18 am
zeko wrote:
On BFA's home page, the article explaining the substitute HB142 is misleading . . . in a table comparing the current situation with sub HB142, the last line states:

Does presenting your CHL to the officer satisfy the requirement
to notify? (present situation) No (under sub HB142) Yes

Actually under sub HB142, one can present one's CHL, but one must also NOTIFY THAT ONE IS CARRYING A HANDGUN -- just handing over the CHL doesn't completely satify the notification requirement.

zeko

And this is *exactly* one of the big issues with this bill. Media and even Rep. Wiggam, and now BFA, are putting out inaccurate information that has the real possibility of causing an otherwise law-abiding citizen to end up with "Carrying Concealed Weapons" on their record if this bill passes. Have fun explaining that to prospective employers, landlords, etc. Well, if they even give you the chance, I bet most times you just won't hear back.

This bill needs to die.

Christian, Husband, Father
NRA Life Member
NRA Certified Range Safety Officer
NRA Certified Pistol & Rifle Instructor
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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:27 am
I agree that the substitute bill is a turd. That said history on Ohio seems to indicate a large success rate with "pass a bill into law, ANY bill into law, then amend, amend, amend. Our CCW law was a huge steaming pile of poop when it first passed, and it has been amended into something decent. Right to Work is an example of over reaching and getting smacked down and smacked down HARD. Had they passed smaller increment that only involved private employers, then if it survived amend, amend, amend then Ohio might be right there with MI and IN right now on that issue.

Bill

America NO LONGER held hostage by ZERO the lying dictator.......:-)

Ohio, a government of the unions, by the unions, for the unions
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Post subject: Re: HB 142
Post Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:40 pm
The leadership of BFA does NOT monitor the forum. Our position doesn't count. How long did it take them to understand the evils of the hidden compartment bill.

Kill HB 142, now, if anybody is listening.
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