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Post subject: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 10:31 am
Last night there was an armed man who threatened to harm to himself and others then refused to come out of his apartment. As officers set up a perimeter, SWAT arrived and negotiations continued, there was an obvious police presence. Then a neighbor decides to grab his shotgun, exit his apartment and stand nearby to "protect his girl friend"..... By the way the shotgun was unloaded.

This guy almost won a Darwin Award. Lucky for him there were smart officers on scene. The primary suspect was later taken into custody and the prosecutor is looking at the incident of the "protective boyfriend" for possible charges.

Idiots like this give gun owners a bad name.

Thoughts? Should he be charged?

Stay Safe, Andrew

To whom much is given much is expected

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Post subject: Re: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 11:03 am
Common sense isn't so common... I see this guy as an idiot. Just because you can doesn't mean you must.

-Matt

Better to keep one's mouth shut and be thought a fool than open it and remove all doubt.
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Post subject: Re: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 11:13 am
Although I think the individual in question was misguided on several fronts, I don't know what he could be charged with other than stupidity, which currently isn't against the law.

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Post subject: Re: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 12:03 pm
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Post subject: Re: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 12:11 pm
CW78 wrote:
Image


I have soda in my nasal passages now... You win the interwebz for today.




ETA - For context here's a parody video for the original from which the screen grab above originated...



You know on second thought this guy might have done the right thing. It appears he is smart enough to be vice president...

-Matt

Better to keep one's mouth shut and be thought a fool than open it and remove all doubt.
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Post subject: Re: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 1:40 pm
That quote comes to mind every time I hear of someone doing something stupid with a shotgun.

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Post subject: Re: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 4:51 pm
First off, I agree. It is Biden's fault.

The subject in this incident can be charged with Disorderly Conduct.

Stay Safe, Andrew

To whom much is given much is expected

http://apexshooting.com

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Joined: Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:56 pm
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Post subject: Re: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 7:45 pm
With all due respect, ApexShootingTactics, in the state of Ohio in the absence of any other illegal conduct, simply exercising ones constitutional rights does not constitute disorderly conduct or any other offense. He would have had to do something else - and he may have, I don't know, but from what I read in your post there is nothing I can see that you could charge him with.

Christian, Husband, Father
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Post subject: Re: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 8:47 pm
CW78 wrote:
Image

the "shotgun joe biden" defense... :lol:

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Post subject: Re: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 9:07 pm
JustaShooter,

Given what little detail about the situation you don't think this fits, Creating a condition that is physically offensive to persons or that presents a risk of physical harm to persons or property, by any act that serves no lawful and reasonable purpose of the offender.

Your comment about the subject just exercising his constitutional rights. Are you saying that it is ok to approach law enforcement, unannounced and open carrying a long gun at the scene of a barricaded subject?

Stay Safe, Andrew

To whom much is given much is expected

http://apexshooting.com

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Post subject: Re: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 9:26 pm
I have to agree with Apex. Not sure it would survive through court, but it's not a smart thing and not something a prudent person would do. I think a lot IMO depends on how close the two buildings are. I know generally when there's a SWAT callout at an apartment complex they evacuate the building. They then tell the surrounding buildings to stay inside.

2917.13 Misconduct at Emergency is one that comes to mind to me at a SWAT callout.
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Post subject: Re: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 10:52 pm
JediSkipdogg wrote:
I have to agree with Apex. Not sure it would survive through court, but it's not a smart thing and not something a prudent person would do. I think a lot IMO depends on how close the two buildings are. I know generally when there's a SWAT callout at an apartment complex they evacuate the building. They then tell the surrounding buildings to stay inside.

2917.13 Misconduct at Emergency is one that comes to mind to me at a SWAT callout.

I agree.

The Legislative Service Commission’s Note about this offense explained that this section is “aimed primarily at controlling bystanders and curiosity seekers at emergency scenes, in order to permit police, fire brigades, rescue and medical personnel, and others, to perform their duties with the utmost efficiency at such times.” The offense is described as “a specific tool for crowd control at emergencies” but the offense “need not necessarily arise from the collective conduct of a crowd but may be committed by one person.” The Note sets forth an example of “one who simply gets underfoot at an emergency and is consciously aware he is doing so * * *.” R.C. 2917.13, Legislative Service Commission Note (1973).
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Post subject: Re: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 8:38 am
No charges were filed.

A follow up interview was done and the subject explained his actions. The subject reported not knowing about the incident taking place or that LE being on scene. The subject's girlfriend was about to leave work at a near by business and when she discovered what was happening she called the subject and was hysterical on the phone. The subject reported he only understood that she couldn't come home because there was a man with a gun. So he grabbed the shotgun and decided to go see what was happening with his girlfriend and he ends up walking out into the scene.

So situational awareness almost got this man killed in several different ways.
1. He did not understand the threat/situation so his plan to deal with it was doomed to fail.
2. Shotgun was unloaded. He reported not knowing the condition of the weapon. Ben Franklin once said, By failing to prepare we prepare to fail. Check your gun and kit. That "click of death" will be the loudest sound you will ever hear in a gun fight.
3. Fail to call for help. We are not a rural community and cell service is great. No excuse not to call 911 and let them know what is going on. One, it may offer more information to the responder and Two it will let the possible responding officers know of your intentions/actions. In this case just calling 911 they would have been able to clue him in on what was going on.

Stay Safe, Andrew

To whom much is given much is expected

http://apexshooting.com

https://www.facebook.com/ApexShootingTactics
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Post subject: Re: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 12:06 pm
so If I understand it right a guy is holed up in his apartment threatening people, swat shows up.. boyfriend unrelated to the incident in the other apartment comes out standing guard at his door with a shotgun?

that wasn't even loaded!?

Seems like a bad idea to come out holding a gun while swat has the building surrounded.

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Post subject: Re: A time and a place for open carry.
Post Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 8:26 pm
So the guy is holding a gun while he is standing in his own doorway on his own property? What part of "shall not be infringed" could possibly apply? Just because the cops have itchy trigger fingers does not make them right even if they know they would get away with shooting him.
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