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letting the enemy win

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  • #16
    The folks at ATF, who've always had a free hand at determining who's a dealer, will now (apparently) have a bit more freedom at it.

    That could sneak up and bite somebody trying to sell off a collection from somebody's estate, for example. I'm not sure how you'd do that and not be classed as a dealer....

    Easy. The law itself says:
    (21) The term “engaged in the business” means—

    (C) as applied to a dealer in firearms, as defined in section 921(a)(11)(A), a person who devotes time, attention, and labor to dealing in firearms as a regular course of trade or business with the principal objective of livelihood and profit through the repetitive purchase and resale of firearms, but such term shall not include a person who makes occasional sales, exchanges, or purchases of firearms for the enhancement of a personal collection or for a hobby, or who sells all or part of his personal collection of firearms;

    So, if I inherit a collection of firearms from someone's estate, and sell all or part of them, I am not a dealer. (Well, unless I'm also doing other things that make me a dealer).

    Now, if I'm an estate auction company then yeah, I'll need an FFL - but I already do if that's a part of my business.
    Christian, Husband, Father
    NRA Life Member
    NRA Certified Range Safety Officer
    NRA Certified Pistol & Rifle Instructor


    • #17

      I don't think the "No Fly List" is part of today's unconstitutional acts, although a push to get medical info (mental health info) into the mix may be in there someplace.
      so, it seems as this for an example
      a lot of folks have missed that obama binladin has actually been perusing this fervently

      a quote from todays bfa newsletter

      Prohibiting people listed on the government’s secret terrorist watchlist and its secret subsidiary, the federal no-fly list, from buying guns is again on the table. President Obama expressed the argument simply the other night when he said, “If you’re too dangerous to board a plane, you’re too dangerous, by definition, to buy a gun.”

      so, as a person who wants to find out about what lists he is on, and where to obtain this secrect, protected data,,,how do i do my research?
      The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress:FrederickDouglass

      learning is good .understanding is better .pleas teach with wisdom


      • #18
        so, as a person who wants to find out about what lists he is on, and where to obtain this secrect, protected data,,,how do i do my research?


        At this time, trying to buy a gun, or trying to board a plane may be the only way, although a friendly FFL Dealer may be willing to run that check for you. Might not be legal, though.... Some dealers will charge you if the NICS check fails when actually purchasing. I don't think a 4473 is necessary. (Anybody?) AFAIK, too, there's no way to see what you've been blacklisted for.

        Among the insanities here is the resulting list of gun owners, if not the actual gun information, and the inability to get OFF one of those lists without being a public figure of some kind. Straight out of Kafka....

        And, don't forget that the NICS files are somewhat fuzzy, although there is a functional way to get that stuff cleared, or at least get past it. There actually is a way to get off those other watch lists, but implementation has NOT been funded....

        Zero is probably right about the "too dangerous" thing, but only if there is recourse for errors and such. 'Course, he doesn't want that....

        The current phase seems to be incremental denial of rights, until nobody has any.

        <t>Stu<br><br>(Why write a quick note when you can write a novel?)<br><br>ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒE<br><br>יזכר לא עד פעם</t>