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BREAKING NEWS: House panel votes out bill ending concealed carry licensing

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  • #16
    Ahh. Patience young grasshoppers.
    Just because you don't hear, does not mean we are not talking.
    Legislation is introduced for many reasons, becoming law is not the most common.
    I'm not criticizing that. I understand and defend it. It is not the problem, it is the reaction to the problem - us (we the people) not paying attention to what matters.

    At any rate, I and other leaders of BFA have supported constitutional carry since before there was a BFA.
    I know others are claiming different, just like many don't know the sun rises in the east every morning. Neither group are worth my time to debate. I don't need to debate what I know to be an absolute certainty.

    Legislation is generally passed before it is introduced. It's like a Sudoku puzzle. Filling in squares quickly with no thought or plan does not solve the puzzle quicker.

    BFA has a record of getting things done. Compare our record against any other entity, on any timeline you choose.
    Jim
    PS - My posts need to get approved too. Get over it.

    Comment


    • #17
      Welcome, or maybe welcome back to the forums, Jim. Been a while. Not as long as the last time Linda Walker stopped by though.


      ​​Maybe your post was meant to be humorous or lighten the mood here a bit, but to me it came off as condescending. In fact I didn't feel inclined to approve it, but as stated elsewhere I'm mostly just a doorman/bouncer for this board.
      <t>"I have decided not to vote, speak in public, assemble in groups or petition my government either directly or by writing to the newspapers. <br><br> Some ignorant person may become alarmed, and we can't have that.''<br><br>--CAR15A2, 3/31/09</t>

      Comment


      • #18
        Not meant to be condescending or humorous. I can't move legislation bickering on the forum, and I spend an inordinate amount of time working on various legislative ideas/bills. There is only so much time, and being here means I'm not getting work done. But, I also understand and agree with the idea we need to do a better job communicating. At the end of the day, "I" can't move legislation. "We" do it. BFA and our members/supporters and other groups/people engaged in a helpful manor. It's tough to do when we don't communicate. So I had some time and clarified some things so that people are not mislead.

        Our biggest enemy is not Bloomberg, it's the anti-gun/misinformed gun owner. Know your source.

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by jirvine View Post
          Not meant to be condescending or humorous. I can't move legislation bickering on the forum, and I spend an inordinate amount of time working on various legislative ideas/bills. There is only so much time, and being here means I'm not getting work done. But, I also understand and agree with the idea we need to do a better job communicating. At the end of the day, "I" can't move legislation. "We" do it. BFA and our members/supporters and other groups/people engaged in a helpful manor. It's tough to do when we don't communicate. So I had some time and clarified some things so that people are not mislead.

          Our biggest enemy is not Bloomberg, it's the anti-gun/misinformed gun owner. Know your source.
          Yes, your stories are weeks late, and you do not support pro-2nd Amendment bills that are not your creation, evidently. The first time ever Constitutional Carry passes through the Regulatory committee and you didn't even testify in support of it? What kind of brotherly love is that?

          If we worked with everyone, I think we could do major things in re establishing gun rights in Ohio. Don't you?


          I carry a firearm because a cop is too heavy and takes too many breaks.

          Montani Semper Liberi - (Mountaineers Are Always Free)

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by chuck View Post

            See, here's the thing about this group.
            You post "NEVER" in capital letters; I post a well known fact disputing that.
            And your response makes it sound as though I am the one being deceptive.


            We don't need to wait for the lame duck
            We SHOULDN'T wait for the lame duck.
            And if waiting for the lame duck is why we haven't heard from BFA on this legislation, I say that's a poor strategy.




            I have 81 posts; how many posts does it take? (most places use five or so)
            I suspect the setting you are looking for is in your general settings, not individual profiles.
            All members must be approved who are not staff, something like.
            Good luck with that, Forums, eh?
            Sorry Chuck, you are correct in that I never should have said it never happened. Was not trying to make you sound deceptive sir! Just pointing out the facts, should have done it more tactfully...

            No, that is not the strategy...


            You've only had a couple posts since the reboot, it doesn't take into consideration your post count prior to that. I may have found the setting that was causing the issue... not entirely sure tho. We'll see if it fixes things. Spammers and spam account generation was so rampant at the beginning I was trying everything to get it under control. There was an option to put key words into a background word search for new posts that would need approval. Although all of those words were in foreign languages, there may have been some letter combinations that automatically threw peoples posts into the moderation queue inadvertently. I removed that road block, so let us see if that does not resolve the issue.
            Hence it is, that democracies have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have, in general, been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths. James Madison, Federalist Paper No 10

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by wvriflemannoh View Post



              If we worked with everyone, I think we could do major things in re establishing gun rights in Ohio. Don't you?

              If we were all on the same sheet of music, yes. Rowing in opposite directions does not increase the speed of the boat.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by jirvine View Post

                If we were all on the same sheet of music, yes. Rowing in opposite directions does not increase the speed of the boat.


                You mean your way or the highway?

                Or, Does that mean you will start actually fighting harder with other pro-2A / Constitutional supporters and not compromising on garbage legislation that promise morsels and permission slips for restored 2md Amendment rights?

                We shouldn't have to beg for this and this is exactly what you have been doing for the last 25 years, if that. I assure you, these politicians didn't hesitate to take our rights away. We need better and more results than that.


                Again, play tough, consistent, repetitive and persistent offense, not passive compromising defense.

                We need to work together and leave no doubt in the minds of these people who these politicians work for.



                To quote an American judge:

                "To prohibit a citizen from wearing or carrying a war arm...is an unwarranted restriction upon the constitutional right to keep and bear arms. If some cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of constitutional privilege." [
                Wilson Vs. States (1878)]

                I carry a firearm because a cop is too heavy and takes too many breaks.

                Montani Semper Liberi - (Mountaineers Are Always Free)

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by wvriflemannoh View Post
                  [/COLOR]


                  [B][COLOR=#000080]Again, play tough, consistent, repetitive and persistent offense, not passive compromising defense.

                  That was how things went from mid-late 90's until 2003. Including Constitutional carry. (Called "Vermont style" back then) Brinkman ran it. Post for us all the great progress that was made with that approach.

                  Then we'll take a look at what progress has been made in the years since and compare what benefited gun owners more.

                  Or maybe it's you who mean your way or the highway.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by jirvine View Post

                    That was how things went from mid-late 90's until 2003. Including Constitutional carry. (Called "Vermont style" back then) Brinkman ran it. Post for us all the great progress that was made with that approach.

                    Then we'll take a look at what progress has been made in the years since and compare what benefited gun owners more.

                    Or maybe it's you who mean your way or the highway.
                    Hey, you’re the one unwilling to work well with others with the same mind set. Again, we are talking about REPUBLICANS who are suppose to be for the Constitution and the true intent of 2nd Amendment, NOT DEMOCRATS Who are attacking everything 2A. There should be No COMPROMISING ON OUR RIGHTS NEEDED. Or are you just too arrogant and condescending to see that?

                    Why are we having such a hard time passing pro 2nd Amendment Bills with a Republican run Ohio Government? Can you explain that too me Jim?

                    BTW, BFA’s record in Pro-2A laws are not that great compared to other states. You want to see a true fighter for the 2A Jim, go talk to the WVCDL in West Virginia. They didn’t coddle the Politicians. Even with a Democrat Governor, they over rode his veto of Constitutional Carry Bill and got it passed.

                    That’s getting it done Jim.

                    Just some Constructive Criticism Jim, hope you see the light.

                    Also, did you know that as a hunter in Ohio, you can not open or conceal carry a sidearm while you are bow hunting or muzzleloader hunting for self defense without a paid permission slip Jim? I’ve called the DNR to see about how we can change that, they referred me back to the State AG’s office. Called them, they referred me back to the ODNR. I’ve been attack’s by wild dogs more than once while in my blind Jim and only had one shot. Do you know how that feels Jim? Not to mention Drug cartel protecting their crops on lands hunters had no clue were there. Why do we need a paid permission slip for that? Poachers will poach, really sick and tired of hear people in authority who works for us telling me I must surrender my rights because of the criminals. WVCDL got that problem fixed as well.

                    Were you aware of this at all Jim?

                    I also love your attiutude of the ridiculousness of your forum. Never seen another like it. Way to promote it, “
                    PS - My posts need to get approved too. Get over it.”

                    Wow! I can see why you get along with the Politicians so well. You coddle them and treat your fellow guns owners who do not agree with you like crap!

                    Smh.



                    I carry a firearm because a cop is too heavy and takes too many breaks.

                    Montani Semper Liberi - (Mountaineers Are Always Free)

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by wvriflemannoh View Post

                      Hey, you’re the one unwilling to work well with others with the same mind set. Again, we are talking about REPUBLICANS who are suppose to be for the Constitution and the true intent of 2nd Amendment, NOT DEMOCRATS Who are attacking everything 2A. There should be No COMPROMISING ON OUR RIGHTS NEEDED. Or are you just too arrogant and condescending to see that?

                      Why are we having such a hard time passing pro 2nd Amendment Bills with a Republican run Ohio Government? Can you explain that too me Jim?

                      BTW, BFA’s record in Pro-2A laws are not that great compared to other states. You want to see a true fighter for the 2A Jim, go talk to the WVCDL in West Virginia. They didn’t coddle the Politicians. Even with a Democrat Governor, they over rode his veto of Constitutional Carry Bill and got it passed.

                      That’s getting it done Jim.

                      Just some Constructive Criticism Jim, hope you see the light.

                      Also, did you know that as a hunter in Ohio, you can not open or conceal carry a sidearm while you are bow hunting or muzzleloader hunting for self defense without a paid permission slip Jim? I’ve called the DNR to see about how we can change that, they referred me back to the State AG’s office. Called them, they referred me back to the ODNR. I’ve been attack’s by wild dogs more than once while in my blind Jim and only had one shot. Do you know how that feels Jim? Not to mention Drug cartel protecting their crops on lands hunters had no clue were there. Why do we need a paid permission slip for that? Poachers will poach, really sick and tired of hear people in authority who works for us telling me I must surrender my rights because of the criminals. WVCDL got that problem fixed as well.

                      Were you aware of this at all Jim?

                      I also love your attiutude of the ridiculousness of your forum. Never seen another like it. Way to promote it, “
                      PS - My posts need to get approved too. Get over it.”

                      Wow! I can see why you get along with the Politicians so well. You coddle them and treat your fellow guns owners who do not agree with you like crap!

                      Smh.


                      The republicans in the Ohio legislature are not what you may think they are. DeWine voted for the Clinton assault weapons ban and much worse, and he has influence over legislators. Look at what Taft and Kasich did. Kasich worked behind the scenes to frustrate pro freedom legislative efforts while claiming to support them. It would not surprise me if DeWine is doing the same thing. Look at what republicans have done to Donald Trump. There are a lot of things going on behind the scenes that we are not aware of.

                      While I support the bill that is referred to as constitutional carry, it is not really constitutional carry. Constitutional carry would be deleting Ohio's criminal offenses for CCW and improper transportation of firearms in motor vehicles, etc..., instead of adding all of that gobbledygook. I think a higher priority should be abolishing criminal protection zones. I would rather be able to carry in more places instead of just not having to renew my license. And for hunting, go get a concealed handgun license. You have a hunting license don't you? It should not be necessary, but there is a mechanism for being able to carry a handgun while hunting, but there is no mechanism to carry any kind of a weapon in the library where criminals know everyone is disarmed for their convenience. I liked the bill from last session that limited the criminal offenses to only if an armed person refused to leave after being asked to leave after discovery of being armed.
                      "Laws that forbid the carrying of arms**disarm only those who [don't] commit crimes. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than prevent homicides." - Thomas Jefferson.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by liberty View Post

                        The republicans in the Ohio legislature are not what you may think they are. DeWine voted for the Clinton assault weapons ban and much worse, and he has influence over legislators. Look at what Taft and Kasich did. Kasich worked behind the scenes to frustrate pro freedom legislative efforts while claiming to support them. It would not surprise me if DeWine is doing the same thing. Look at what republicans have done to Donald Trump. There are a lot of things going on behind the scenes that we are not aware of.

                        So, you are content Republicans acting like Police State Socialists, Fascist Democrats?

                        THERE SHOULD BE NOTHING GOING ON BEHIND THE SCENES. THERE SHOULD BE COMPLETE AND UTTER TRANSPARENCY IN OUR GOVERNMENT. We should not be negotiating our rights "behind the scenes". That's a cause for corruption. We need to start taking back our govt.


                        While I support the bill that is referred to as constitutional carry, it is not really constitutional carry. Constitutional carry would be deleting Ohio's criminal offenses for CCW and improper transportation of firearms in motor vehicles, etc...

                        Are you serious? Ohio's law is so stupid and Unconstitutional. Your vehicle is your home away from and one of you most vulnerable unsafe places to be in in stopped traffic or parking lots. YOU CANT GET YOUR FIREARM OUT OF THE TRUNK IF THUGS ARE SMASHING IN YOUR GLASS TO DRAG YOU OUT OF THE CAR TO RAPE OR KILL YOU. Why if I pay the state money, all of sudden I can carry in my front seat, loaded and ready to go? You should NOT HAVE ANY RESTRICTIONS HOW YOU ARE TRANSPORTING A FIREARM IN YOUR VEHICLE. ITS ABSURD.

                        WV did away with all restrictions on how you carry in your vehicles with their CC and nothing changed in crime, accidents or the way the cops pulls you over. THAT IS ANOTHER LIE BY LE and POLITICIANS in Ohio Who want to CONFISCATE your guns because they have authority over you in your vehicle to confiscate them because you didn't transport them the way the assholes in Columbus thinks you should be carrying them WITHOUT A PAID PERMISSION SLIP. WAKE UP! SUPPORT TRUE FREEDOM! GOVERNMENT PERMISSION SLIPS ARE NOT FREEDOM. And is not protecting your Constitutional rights.




                        , instead of adding all of that gobbledygook. I think a higher priority should be abolishing criminal protection zones. I would rather be able to carry in more places instead of just not having to renew my license. And for hunting, go get a concealed handgun license.

                        NO! Are you hearing yourself? We can chew gum and walk at the same time. Gun Free Zones are unconstitutional and needs to have a sweeping bill in DC to end them all along with the states. Paying for a permission slip from your tyrant is not protecting and defending your Constitutional rights. Let me ask you this. Do you think the founders who was trying to protect the people from an authoritarian Tyrannical Government would want you to be paying for a permission slip to be armed in anyway, carrying in anyway or anywhere to fight the tyranny of that same government? HELL NO! And you support needing a permission slip to protect your self in the woods. HAHAHA.



                        You have a hunting license don't you? It should not be necessary, but there is a mechanism for being able to carry a handgun while hunting, but there is no mechanism to carry any kind of a weapon in the library where criminals know everyone is disarmed for their convenience.

                        Again, read above. Evidently you don't hunt. A bow and Muzzleloader are ONE SHOT WEAPONS.They are not the auto re-loaders like you see in the movies or on TV. Time is the factor when you are being attacked by a pack of wild or rabid dogs, coyotes, foxes or even a a human being who may want to do you harm while in the woods. And now, black bears are increasing in Ohio. And they will attack you for a number of reasons no matter what the ODNR says. I grew up around black bears, I've seen what they are capable of.

                        And No, you do not need to give the state your finger prints and be treated like you are guilty of crime to conceal or open carry for any reason in this country. CRIMINALS CARRY ANYTIME, ANYWAY AND ANYWHERE THEY PLEASE but us Law Abiding Citizens must get a PAID permission slip from our tyrannical government? Again, the amount of gun owners who think asking their tyrant for a paid permission slip to carry their weapons in any way is ASTOUNDING. You may own a gun but you have no understanding of the true intent of the 2nd Amendment. and that's a serious problem. Stop accepting we can and should be negotiating our gun rights away behind closed doors by people who couldn't care less about your individual life but want to control every aspect over it.



                        I liked the bill from last session that limited the criminal offenses to only if an armed person refused to leave after being asked to leave after discovery of being armed.

                        Again, we can chew gum and walk at the same time. Call your reps and tell them to support a clean Constitutional Carry Bill HB178

                        "The Constitution of most of our states (and of the United States) assert that all power is inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves; that it is their right and duty to be at all times armed." - Thomas Jefferson


                        Funny, I don't see a BUT at the end of the 2nd Amendment and I don't see anywhere the founders said there are limits on our individual rights anywhere. It's the complete opposite.

                        Do you know why? Because the Constitution was created to limit and restrict the authority of the Government, not the people.

                        When, or If, The American people ever figure that out again, we might have our true rights, liberty and freedoms back again. But the ignorance of our Constitution is getting worse not better. And it will not end well. I just hope I'm not around to see it.

                        I Never thought I'd see these kind of attacks on our rights, freedoms and liberties like I have in my life time. Both parties are a disgrace, and the treachery to our country is astounding.

                        Ask yourself this, Who cares more about your life than you do? Who can protect you the most at the scene of an active violent / crime scene? No one, but you.

                        So why do you think the Govt has any right to tell you how, when, where and what you can use to protect the only life you have?

                        I choose True Freedom! Do you?

                        I'd rather live in dangerous freedom than peaceful slavery any day. Do you?

                        Last edited by wvriflemannoh; 07-14-2019, 07:28 AM.
                        I carry a firearm because a cop is too heavy and takes too many breaks.

                        Montani Semper Liberi - (Mountaineers Are Always Free)

                        Comment


                        • liberty
                          liberty commented
                          Editing a comment
                          I think everyone here understands that all of the gun laws are unconstitutional. I cannot, however, say the same for enough elected officials to abolish the unconstitutional laws. We may be able to walk and chew gum at the same time, but apparently our elected officials cannot. And because of these realities, BFA has found a work-around, and has been able to accomplish things that otherwise may have not been accomplished. The way to change this is to identify and primary republicans who do not understand the Constitution, but that is easier said than done.

                          From your response, I am not sure you fully understood what I wrote. You might want to calm down and read it again.
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